Same Standard Man or Woman

Over at OpenLeft, there's a front paged post by former NARAL President Kate Michelman, on Hillary Clinton's use of gender in the 2008 Presidential campaign.  I was happy to see that Michelman's take largely echo my own, especially since she has so much more credibility on the subject than I do.

Michelman's post revolves around the state of the women's movement, how far it has come, how far it has to go and the best way to advance it.

She notes the many disproportionate economic hurdles women face in the US and then asks how Clinton's candidacy would affect women:

As women take a second look at the candidates, now that attention is focusing more on the issues and how each of the candidates would lead, how they would make decisions; now that making a choice is becoming real, less about celebrity, more about being president, legitimate questions are being raised about Senator Clinton.

And we're all learning something.

When unchallenged, in a comfortable, controlled situation, Senator Clinton embraces her political elevation into the "boys club." She is quick to assure listeners she is plenty tough enough, that she's battled tested, ready to play be the same rules as the boys.

But when she's challenged, when legitimate questions are asked, questions she should be prepared to answer and discuss, she is just as quick to raise the white flag and look for a change in the rules. She then calls questioning, 'attacking;' she calls debate among her peers, 'piling on.'

While Clinton's use of her gender as a diversion, she'd much rather us be debating whether she was attacked because she's a woman than her actual debate performance, is politically smart.  It doesn't advance the larger project of gender equality.  As Michelman closes:

It is not presidential.

Any serious candidate for president should have to answer tough questions and defend their record.

Any serious candidate for president should make their views clear and let the American people know where they stand on issues.

And any serious candidate for president should be held to the same standard - whether man or woman.

I think Hillary Clinton is plenty strong enough to face tough questions without using her gender as a diversion to avoid answering them.  Instead of playing dodgeball with tough issues, she could just give straight answers.  



Display:


More from Kate. (2.00 / 5)

We've Come a Long Way, by Kate Michelman

Remember the commercial:

We've come a long way baby.

Well, have we? That's the question American women need to ask themselves.

We earn 77 cents for every dollar a man makes.

We are 48% more likely to live in poverty than men.

17 million adult women lack health insurance.

Millions of us struggle to balance jobs and the needs of our families.

A long way? Not nearly long enough.

snip

It's a political strategy, no doubt focus grouped and poll tested: make it look unseemly that this group of men would question her and hold her accountable for her record.

It's trying to have it both ways; walk the fence, something Senator Clinton's good at. At one minute the strong woman ready to lead, the next, she's the woman under attack, disingenuously playing the victim card as a means of trying to avoid giving honest, direct answers to legitimate questions.

As a woman who's been in the public eye and experienced scrutiny, as a woman who knows how hard it can be for women to earn their seat at the leadership table, how hard women have to work just to get the same opportunities, this distresses me.

Kate is right!

Great diary.


by TomP on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 04:53:08 PM EST

Re: Same Standard Man or Woman (2.00 / 4)

Well said MEAE and Kate.

Hopefully Clinton will cease with using the gender card in this race.  As a female, I was appalled by the misstep, but even worse, the campaign using this pile on BS and sez she needs more money.  Last time I checked, $80M buys quite a few ads already to state her case.


by benny06 on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 04:55:05 PM EST

Its a great diary (2.00 / 4)

illuminating how truly disappointing the Clinton's campaigns use of gender to distract from a poor debate and issue waffling really is.


by okamichan13 on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 04:55:10 PM EST

Re: Its a great diary (2.00 / 2)

pathetic I agree, hopefully the Iowa voters who are paying attention will see through her little stunt. Hillary's is now runnign on thinly dsiguised platform that she's a Clinton and seh's a woman. Dems deserve to lose if we nominate someone based on that.


Obama! because 51% isn't enough!
by nevadadem on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 05:04:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

And I hope that there are more NV dems ... (2.00 / 3)

... paying attention, because one state does not a slingshot strategy make.

Certainly the events of this week are not enough to de-rail the Double-Talk Pander Express ... but it is an opening to start the conversation for real.


*John Edwards* ... and the JE08 Supporters Blog
by BruceMcF on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 05:08:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

what a tool (none / 0)

Dems deserve to lose if we nominate someone based on that.

i cant wait until feb 8th so fools like you will just go over to nader and be gone.

It will be fine by me.


"I never give them hell. I just tell the truth and they think it's hell." Democrat Party "Hack" and President Harry S Truman
by holden caulfield on Sun Nov 04, 2007 at 01:08:44 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: what a tool (none / 0)

So many Hillary supporters on here like to label anyone who questions Hillary or support someone else a Naderite. Yet those being labeled as such are good democrats backing other democrats in the presidential primary. It's some of those Hillary supporters who aren't loyal to the party. areyouready isn't a democrat and neither is hwc.

After everything is said and done 99%+ of those who post here are going to fall into line like the good loyal democrats we are and vote for the democratic nominee for president even if we have to hold our noses while doing so. Up until that point though we intend to have a vigorous and intense primary.

It's sad that some people despise the democratic process and anyone who doesn't immediately fall into line behind Hillary and the desired coronation that anyone who questions her must be a Naderite rather than a loyal democrat.


by Quinton on Sun Nov 04, 2007 at 01:02:55 PM EST
[ Parent ]

bull (none / 0)

any one who joins chris matthews and company ancd accuses hillary of being a liar and corrupt - AFTER WATCHING HOW THEWY DID THEAME THING IN @))) - are to stupid to get anything but my contempt - and let me tell ya - there are PLENTY of people here and at KOS who have proudly said that they will vote for nader - and if you wont - and you are just giving comfort to our gop enemies by adopting their attacks on both Clintons - well, that disgusts me almost as much...

Got it?


"I never give them hell. I just tell the truth and they think it's hell." Democrat Party "Hack" and President Harry S Truman
by holden caulfield on Sun Nov 04, 2007 at 05:24:01 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Same Standard Man or Woman (none / 0)

She gives straight answers- the other candidates refuse to listen and twist and misrepresent the things she says because they know they can't win on their own merit or proposals.


by reasonwarrior on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 05:09:45 PM EST

Hillary Hacks (2.00 / 1)

are so delusional it is not even funny.

I'm surprised that you aren't a Kucinich supporter.  He's the only one who campaigns on planet Zarkon, which is where Hillary Hacks must be spending their time lately.

Oh, and why don't you low-info Clinton supporters (oops, I forgot, there is no other kind) actually learn something about polls before you talk about them.

Only 10% vote in primaries.  Yet national primary polls include ALL registered Democrats.  That makes NO sense.  Low-info Dems (that means you) love Senator Clinton, because frankly, they don't know much. And they make up the vast majority of the sample.

Plus, the race is won state by state and the movement happens at the end.

Notice that, in the Iowa polls with even a half-way decent screen (ARG's polls on both sides of the aisle are shit, compare them to everyone else's and you will see what I mean), without even running an add yet Edwards is withing striking distance.

In 04' the last Iowa poll showed Edwards with 8%.
He finished in the 30's.

John Kerry was at 9% nationally, right before he won Iowa.  10 days later he had shot up 40%.  The low-info Dems follow the actual voters' lead.

So for you guys to continually cite national primary polls shows just reveals your proud ignorance.

Hillary 08' - Proud to be Stupid


The bold progressive leader is the most electable candidate. Reclaim the Democratic Party! Support John Edwards.
by Michael 4 Edwards on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 06:12:04 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary Hacks (2.00 / 1)

Your post is over the top. If you had started with "Only 10 vote in the primaries" i think it would have conveyed the point better.


by bruh21 on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 06:17:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Hillary Hacks (none / 0)

You keep claiming to be so smart, we'll see how smart you are.  


by reasonwarrior on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 09:55:02 PM EST
[ Parent ]

low info fool (2.00 / 1)

you idiots actually think you have deep understanding of politics,,,what a joke.

You dont know shit.  Your campaign is dead as a doornail, it is losing by 4 to one nationally and is not leading in even your candidates home state.

But YOU know better??

it is being headed up by two clowns that i have known and had little respect for one, trippi for two decades and another Mudcat, for a decade...

third raters both.

Your frigging candidate is a phony who couldnt even win his home state in 04 or even have a chance of getting re elected to the senate....but he sure does wanna rule the world doesnt he.

he has changed his positions on just about EVERY frigging issue since his solo election win and now he pretends that its hillary that flip flops...

what a tool you must be to believe that its YOU that actually has any insight into politics.  your candidate is now just parroting the attack scripts written out by those jerks over at msnbc, matthews et al...and you actually think you have insight?

This will bew trippis like 10th losing campaign in a row.

Way to pick em smart boy.

What a joke...

Why dont you put some money down on your 'boy"?  He's down to like 4 bucks at the betting houses.  Hillary is like at 80.

just think a 100 bet will get ya $2500 when Johnny pulls it out...

Why dont ya cash in everything and put it DOWN?  your being so "brilliant' and all, how could ya lose?

Ha- ha- ha!


"I never give them hell. I just tell the truth and they think it's hell." Democrat Party "Hack" and President Harry S Truman
by holden caulfield on Sun Nov 04, 2007 at 01:19:30 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Same Standard Man or Woman (none / 0)

Don't tell me she gives straight answers.  I listened to her every word during the debate and I was just as confused as everybody else.


No Quacks, please.
by noquacks on Sun Nov 04, 2007 at 12:56:35 AM EST
[ Parent ]

This is so going to backfire. (none / 0)


by bookgrl on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 05:11:30 PM EST

Re: This is so going to backfire. (2.00 / 1)

uh if Hillary is inevitable or so far ahead as you guys claim there can't be a "backlash". Hillary tops out at 48-49% against people like Ron Paul so I would applaud annyone trying to save us from a disasterous Hillary nomination. Obama today said the best Hillary could do is "barely win".


Obama! because 51% isn't enough!
by nevadadem on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 05:22:11 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Oh, really? (none / 0)

Got a link to that.


by bookgrl on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 09:27:48 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: This is so going to backfire. (none / 0)

Well, that's true enough.  She can just "barely" win in the general - if that.  I won't vote for her in the primary for many reasons but, if those reasons didn't exist, I still wouldn't vote for her - too risky.


No Quacks, please.
by noquacks on Sun Nov 04, 2007 at 12:58:54 AM EST
[ Parent ]

and your candidate is BEHIND her (none / 0)

and the gOP media junta hasnt even touched em yet?

How clueless is this mantra of you folks?

Your candidate is getting CRUSHED by eithr 2 to 1 or 4 to 1 in a 7 candidate race and you PRETEND that its HILLARY that has electability issues...

The illogic of you folks is breathtaking!


"I never give them hell. I just tell the truth and they think it's hell." Democrat Party "Hack" and President Harry S Truman
by holden caulfield on Sun Nov 04, 2007 at 01:22:18 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Edwards Own Race And Gender Cards (none / 0)

Given Edwards own history of playing the race and gender cards, Michelman's argument has no credibility.

When Elizabeth Edwards blamed the media for their campaigns poor press, she said; ""We can't make John black, we can't make him a woman".

Further, on his recent "Bubba" tour with Mudcat and Cooter, Edwards said:

"If you're running in a tough congressional district somewhere in America, anywhere in America, and I'm in one right now, okay...You gotta ask yourself would you rather have Senator Obama at the top of the ticket to help, Senator Clinton at the top of the ticket to help, or John Edwards at the top of the ticket to help. ... .. You got to have someone who is strong in all those places and who is not a drag on candidates who are trying to win in those places. ... .. The easiest way to do it, honestly, is to picture in your head each of us running in a tough place -- we're in one right now -- and which one's going to be more helpful and which one's not, because I think that does matter."

Finally, while we're being honest, let's not forget the cancer card that Edward played in his "Heros" ad.

If it's OK for Edwards to play these race, gender, and cancer cards, then it's OK for everyone else!


by BigBoyBlue on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 05:18:44 PM EST

Re: Edwards Own Race And Gender Cards (2.00 / 1)

You posted this exact posting over at open left.


by bruh21 on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 06:14:47 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Your hatred drips (none / 0)

off your comment.

Your reference to cancer is so odious.

Too many really nasty Clinton supporters on MyDD.

There are some decent ones, but there are too many nasty ones.


by TomP on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 06:51:00 PM EST
[ Parent ]

tHE VILE STUFF YOU HAVE WRITTEN ABOUT hILLARY (none / 0)

You really are not self aware at all - are ya/


"I never give them hell. I just tell the truth and they think it's hell." Democrat Party "Hack" and President Harry S Truman
by holden caulfield on Sun Nov 04, 2007 at 01:23:37 AM EST
[ Parent ]

I AGREE! (none / 0)

When Obama isn't consistant HAMMER him.  He wants to be "different" then hold him to his word.  No attacks from Obama .. just his "hope" that he goes on and on and on about, and the bipartisanship he claims he can deliver.  When he acts the same and attacks HAMMER him.

Make Edwards be consistant too.  Don't let Edwards get away with railing against corporations when he was a member of the DLC's 'New Democrats' in when he served in the Senate.  He was a corporate Democrat himself.  Now he is just a hypocrit.

Don't let Edwards get away with scoring points by bashing hedge funds when he made large cash working for a hedge fund just over a year ago.  Make Edwards be honest for a change.


by dpANDREWS on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 07:46:32 PM EST

Re: I AGREE! (none / 0)

Yes, the same standard for all...I agree.

And Hillary has hammered Obama.


"Well Hillary, I looking forward to you advising me as well." - Barack Obama
by General Sherman on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 08:53:18 PM EST
[ Parent ]

edwards is the phony (1.00 / 2)

that voters sense him to be.  thats why he is getting crushed even in his home state.

my new line is that he speaks like he's spartacus and lives like Charles foster cane.

After this week, f him, Im done with him.


"I never give them hell. I just tell the truth and they think it's hell." Democrat Party "Hack" and President Harry S Truman
by holden caulfield on Sun Nov 04, 2007 at 01:25:49 AM EST
[ Parent ]

So Sorry, Too Bad (none / 0)

I hate to break the news to you, but gender is the dominant subtext of the 2008 Presidential election. I know it is a subtext that is disturbing to the boys club who see their 230 year stranglehold on Presidential politics threatened. I know it is daunting for the boys club to realize that 60% of the primary electorate and 54% of the general electorate is female. I know it is daunting for the boys club to realize that unmarried women are 25% of the eligible voters and the fastest growing segment of the electorate.

But, I assure you, Senator Clinton has absolutely no intention of backing off on her appeal to women voters in this election. Don't talk to me about "fair". Don't talk to me about how the members of the boys club want the women candidate to conform to their rules and not use gender as an issue. Screw that. If the boys club wanted fair, maybe they shouldn't have prevented women from voting for the first 150 years of our so-called democracy. The boys club didn't seem to have any problem when their rules unfairly favored them.


by hwc on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 09:39:37 PM EST

Re: So Sorry, Too Bad (none / 0)

Yeah, but the fact that Obama is black, doesn't matter. I'd have preferred to be a white woman in 1850 than to be a black man!!


"Well Hillary, I looking forward to you advising me as well." - Barack Obama
by General Sherman on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 10:13:49 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So Sorry, Too Bad (none / 0)

Black men were allowed to vote about 60 years before the first women were allowed to vote.


by hwc on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 10:43:21 PM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: So Sorry, Too Bad (2.00 / 1)

Yeah, that Jim Crow thing was just myth.


"Well Hillary, I looking forward to you advising me as well." - Barack Obama
by General Sherman on Sun Nov 04, 2007 at 01:15:52 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Same Standard Man or Woman (none / 0)

Hillary isn't concerned about other women.


"Well Hillary, I looking forward to you advising me as well." - Barack Obama
by General Sherman on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 10:14:13 PM EST

Re: Same Standard Man or Woman (none / 0)

Men have run on their gender for 230 years of Presidential politics. Run on their gender completely that women weren't even allowed to compete.

Now, you want to take gender out of the equation?

So sorry, too bad.


by hwc on Sat Nov 03, 2007 at 10:42:07 PM EST

Re: Same Standard Man or Woman (2.00 / 1)

Yeah, and I could argue that white folks have had a monopoly on the presidency since the founding. I could further say that Hillary is a privileged white woman attached at the hip to a powerful white man.  


"Well Hillary, I looking forward to you advising me as well." - Barack Obama
by General Sherman on Sun Nov 04, 2007 at 01:18:29 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Same Standard Man or Woman (none / 0)

So this is what?  Affirmative action?


by Shaun Appleby on Sun Nov 04, 2007 at 01:30:03 AM EST
[ Parent ]

Re: Same Standard Man or Woman (none / 0)

Well, white women, not blacks, have been the primary beneficiaries of AA.


"Well Hillary, I looking forward to you advising me as well." - Barack Obama
by General Sherman on Sun Nov 04, 2007 at 01:19:02 AM EST
[ Parent ]

oh how CONVINIENT for you! (none / 0)

Im sure that has nothing to do with your general loathing of all things Hillary.


"I never give them hell. I just tell the truth and they think it's hell." Democrat Party "Hack" and President Harry S Truman
by holden caulfield on Sun Nov 04, 2007 at 01:27:19 AM EST


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