John Edwards for a Progessive Foreign Policy

It seems, according to Matt Yglesias, via a NY Times article, that Barack Obama has better team of foreign policy insiders than Hillary Clinton. Obama has picked up, basically younger and somewhat more liberal insiders than Hillary Clinton's.

The point about better inside advisers is interesting, if you're a DC insider or wanna be insider, but for voters and activists concerned about US foreign policy, it's interesting only as far as it goes. And it doesn't go that far at all.  

A White House foreign policy team is more than the sum of its parts, the work they produce can be improved or hampered by the internal personality dynamics, leadership cues from the top, or group think. Luckily, we don't have to rely on individual reputations. We get to the teams in action during the campaign. Each team produces real policy proposals and is forced to react to events. These reactions, of course, are not a perfect window into how a team will act in office.  But, it shouldn't be dismissed just because they are tainted by politics, politics in foreign policy doesn't go away once you reach the White House.

Ezra Klein is wavering under the influence of his friend and fellow blogger  Yglesias.

I am, at this point, a genuinely undecided voter. I have no clue who I'll pull the lever for in 2008 (though I'm comforted by the fact that my lever-pulling will have absolutely no effect on my party's nominee). But if I were going to decide on Obama, this is exactly why. Insofar as there's a real hope for a new foreign policy, I think it lies with Obama. That's not to say Edwards' policies on this are bad, but what moves him is, as far as I can tell, economic injustice at home, so I think his foreign policy would be a bit secondary. And Hillary Clinton's policies would, as far as I can tell, be bad, at least as compared to the other two.

But, the problem is that isn't really true.  Yglesias and Klein are relying on the inside the beltway reputations of some of the Obama advisers.  Leaving aside the questions of their motives for hitching their wagons to Obama in the first place (careerism is always motive), if one looks at the results coming out of the respective Obama and Edwards teams, the results from Edwards have been far more innovative and far better from a progressive point of view.

Here are the ways Edwards foreign policy positions have actually been much more forward thinking and innovative than Obama's:

  • Yesterday Edwards became the first major Democratic candidate to explicitly reject the preventive war doctrine, and specifically for Iran.
  • As a part of this strategy, I will ask my National Security Advisor to remove President Bush's explicit endorsement of a preventive war doctrine from my National Security Strategies. And I will ask our Joint Chiefs of Staff to form military plans in accordance with proven national security strategies that we know can keep us and our allies safe -- not discredited and dangerous ideological fancies.

    This strategy will keep America and our allies safe -- while showing the world we are once again a strong country that can always win war, but that prefers peace over war. Most importantly, it will restore our legitimacy in the eyes of the world. Everyone knows we're powerful. The question is what we use our power for -- and whether the rest of the world will once again see us as a force for good, rather than the bully we've become under Bush.

    No doubt Obama has been marginally better than Clinton in this campaign, he voted against Iraq funding for the first time this spring moments before Clinton, for example. And Obama adds more equivocations to his support for continued training missions in Iraq than Clinton. Edwards, however, has been the leader. His CITO proposal, for example, helps re-frame the fight against terrorism into multi-lateral effort focused on the activities, such as intelligence that will actually help combat terrorism. Edwards is the only one of the top three to pledge to remove all combat troops from Iraq in a year.

    The real test is what is produced by that team and that campaign.   And by that test Edwards has been the clear choice for progressives.  

    Update [2007-11-6 7:41:27 by MassEyesandEars]: Special thanks to David Mizner for letting me fill in for his Edwards post this week. -AJ



    Display:


    I think Obama made a big mistake (2.00 / 4)

    During his first two years as a senator in voting for Iraq War funding bills that did not contain a timeline for withdrawing troops.


    John McCain: 100 years in Iraq "would be fine with me."
    by desmoinesdem on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 08:08:20 AM EST

    I happen to have agreed with him (none / 0)

    I think there was justified support for hoping to restore some semblance of order even after the disastrous outcome of the war.  I have never understood how it is a contradiction to have opposed the war in the beginning but to be willing to try to stem the consequences of its aftermath.

    I vehemently opposed the war and participated in anti-war marches in Chicago all throughout the run-up to the war, but in 2004 and 2005, it wasn't apparent to me that the best idea was to begin a full withdrawal.  In all honesty, I actually felt too that the US had a responsibility to stay and try to make things better after we had screwed them up so incredibly well.

    To his credit, Obama consistently urged the reduction of troop levels during his early years in the Senate and never backed away from his assertion that the war should never have been fought.

    I think we did, and we still do, have a responsibility to help Iraq rebuild, but it is now apparent, and has been for some time, as Obama too has recognized, that American troops can play next to no constructive role in that process.


    One Million Strong --- Join up
    by psericks on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 11:39:00 AM EST
    [ Parent ]

    Re: I think Obama made a big mistake (none / 0)

    We may have disagreed on the candidates we support but I have the greatest respect for your integrity and the basic integrity of John Edwards. Obama however, is the darling of the media -- I will never vote for a Democratic candidate who is the choice of the neocon media.    


    by changingroom on Wed Nov 07, 2007 at 04:00:37 AM EST
    [ Parent ]

    Re: John Edwards for a Progessive Foreign Policy (none / 0)

    I know Edwards has said he will not leave any troops in Iraq to run combat missions.  But what are "training missions"?  Don't most of the candidates still favor a role training Iraqi troops?


    "Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman
    by Steve M on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 08:13:52 AM EST

    Re: John Edwards for a Progessive Foreign Policy (2.00 / 2)

    he's given a clear number of troops that he will leave in Iraq which is supposed 5,000. Unless this number is wrong, whatever the definition of 'training' is that you are referring to, no one can question that there is some hidden agenda.


    by bruh21 on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 08:23:34 AM EST
    [ Parent ]

    Re: John Edwards for a Progessive Foreign Policy (2.00 / 3)

    Edwards has said he would not leave troops in Iraq for training the Iraqi military. Clinton would keep troops there for that mission. Obama has said he would, though there's been some slight hedging away from that position recently.


    by MassEyesandEars on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 09:06:17 AM EST
    [ Parent ]

    John Edwards on Iraq (2.00 / 5)

    There is no military solution to the chaos in Iraq. Instead, the Iraqi people must solve the problem politically by taking responsibility for their country. By leaving Iraq, America will prompt the Iraqi people, regional powers, and the entire international community to find the political solution that will end the sectarian violence and create a stable Iraq. We must show the Iraqis that we are serious about leaving by actually starting to leave, with an immediate withdrawal of 40,000-50,000 troops and a complete withdrawal within nine to ten months. We should leave behind in Iraq only a brigade of 3,500 to 5,000 troops to protect the embassy and possibly a few hundred troops to guard humanitarian workers.

    http://johnedwards.com/issues/iraq/index .html


    by TomP on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 09:24:50 AM EST
    [ Parent ]

    Re: John Edwards for a Progessive Foreign Policy (2.00 / 2)

    Yes, most of the top tier candidates still favor some role training Iraqi troops:

    • Senator Clinton states it directly
    • Senator Obama supports it with an important qualification ... along the lines of the Iraqi government making progress toward political reconciliation ... I am sure an Obama supporter can provide the direct quote, it was in a major speech on the issue.

    John Edwards proposes one or two missions troops remaining: to guard the embassy, and if we have humanitarian/reconstruction missions in Iraq, to defend the people in those missions.


    *John Edwards* ... and the JE08 Supporters Blog
    by BruceMcF on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 09:27:22 AM EST
    [ Parent ]

    September 15th in Clinton, Iowa (2.00 / 2)

    Here's the quote:

    We will need to retain some forces in Iraq and the region. We'll continue to strike at al Qaeda in Iraq. We'll protect our forces as they leave, and we will continue to protect U.S. diplomats and facilities. If - but only if - Iraq makes political progress and their security forces are not sectarian, we should continue to train and equip those forces.

    Samantha Power has publicly called for freezing aid to govt and militia forces who are basically conducting war crimes against the Sunni minority with American arms and training.

    Obama has also said that a rapid response force dedicated to tracking down al Qaeda in Iraq could be based outside the country and would not have to continue to be a target.

    I really appreciate that multiple Edwards supporters set the record straight on this.  

    I'm happy to say that my interactions with Edwards supporters on this site have greatly improved how I look at him as a candidate.  You've been mostly fair shooters and very often policy-oriented.  I wish I could say the same for Clinton...


    One Million Strong --- Join up
    by psericks on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 11:53:44 AM EST
    [ Parent ]

    Re: September 15th in Clinton, Iowa (none / 0)

    We Clinton supporters ARE nice people.  I am sure you will agree that adhominem attacks on Clinton's character and that of her husband by the media are wrong.  We have seen our elections taken from the people who vote and given to the media elite who think they can destroy any candidate they don't want.  


    by changingroom on Wed Nov 07, 2007 at 04:04:47 AM EST
    [ Parent ]

    Re: John Edwards for a Progessive Foreign Policy (2.00 / 1)

    Leaving aside the questions of their motives for hitching their wagons to Obama in the first place (careerism is always motive)

    I don't know if you're referring to the bloggers or to the advisors, but in either case, you are not "leaving it aside" - that's a rhetorical device so that you can insuate something while pretending not to.  You really should erase that line - it sullies an otherwise fine post.

    But, to more substantive stuff: Edwards inclination to focus on poverty - not only in America, but overseas - is a really a fundamental part of his foreign policy and national defense policy.  It is very much in keeping with traditional Democratic principles about the root causes of dictatorships and violence, so that when Edwards talks about his plan to invest billions in primary education overseas as a way to help arrest severe poverty, and when he links this to our own national security, I'm reminded of the foreign policy speeches of presidents like Franklin Roosevelt and John Kennedy.


    Keep it short. DemocraticShortList.com
    by Rob in Vermont on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 08:16:51 AM EST

    Re: John Edwards for a Progessive Foreign Policy (2.00 / 3)

    One of his biggest foreign policy planks is an effort to share green technological advances with developing countries, so that they can advance economically without producing massive amounts of carbon emissions.


    Join us at Show Me Progress!
    by clarkent on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 08:30:45 AM EST
    [ Parent ]

    Re: John Edwards for a Progessive Foreign Policy (2.00 / 2)

    Criticism noted. It's more a critique of Yglesias's analysis- these good foreign policy people are with Obama so he is good on foreign policy, than it is a criticism of his advisers.  They may be with Obama because they believe in him, or they may be with him because he's their best shot at advancement, or perhaps some combination.  Since we can't know either way we should look to their actions as a part of the team.


    by MassEyesandEars on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 09:11:04 AM EST
    [ Parent ]

    John Edwards Foreign Policy views (none / 0)

    Edwards gave a speech to the Council on Foreign Affairs back in May and published a paper in Foreign Affairs last month (each of the major candidates has used these venues to outline their foreign policy approach in long form). His approach is not as parochial as Klein describes, and it has shifted from a sort of global "two Americas" theme early in the campaign to Iraq and terror.

    The curious thing is that in both of these papers Edwards is focused on the use of the U.S. military and he shows a very American-centric view of foreign policy (Obama is similar). He spends little time discussing diplomacy and international institutions. Clinton, who is generally considered the most hawkish Democrat, writes about the U.S. as one nation among many, and gives more emphasis to our soft power than our military might. Bush's domestic approach to foreign policy is a source of many of our troubles overseas, I find the liberal internationalist alternative foreign policy that Clinton outlines more compelling than the American-centric muscular diplomacy of Edwards or Obama.


    by souvarine on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 08:32:14 AM EST

    Re: John Edwards for a Progessive Foreign Policy (none / 0)

    Edwards isn't leading.  He isn't in a position of leadership.  He is a lawyer running for President.

    In my opinion he is pandering now to a very thin slice of the Democratic electorate.  I think this will hurt him not help him.  I think most Democrats want peace with strength.  I think that is probably why Clinton is leading now.

    America needs to go back the foreign policy that served us from Truman through Clinton.  Hillary is promoting that, Barack is to a certain extent as well.  It is a foreign policy that is tough, vigerous, and has a threat of violence to it, but is clear in its willingness to engage in diplomacy and peace.

    Edwards sounds as if he has taken a sharp left and is getting lost in the weeds on foreign policy.  This no nukes thing is borderline bizarre.  I think many Americans will see now more like a Kucinich than a Clinton, Biden, Richardson, or Obama.


    by dpANDREWS on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 10:09:57 AM EST

    Empty comments (2.00 / 1)

    You continually post inane comments, completely void of any substance.  And you further show your misunderstanding of the candidates positions and world history.

    It is a foreign policy that is tough, vigerous, and has a threat of violence to it, but is clear in its willingness to engage in diplomacy and peace.

    How is that not what Edwards has proposed?  Read the actual text.  Edwards believes that the President will use the authority to protect the country, but promotes a forward-thinking foreign policy.  Carrots and Sticks is not what we've gotten recently, and Edwards advocates a full return.

    This no nukes thing is borderline bizarre.

    Yet you distinguish this as a borderline fringe Edwards/Kucinich idea.  Yet Obama supports it as well.  As does former conservative Dem Senator Sam Nunn.  And Republican Dick Lugar.  And countless others on both sides of the political spectrum.

    You're free to continue posting your odd conjecture and misinformation - but you should know you look like an ass.


    Hoosiers for Hill -- Barack Obama
    by BWasikIUgrad on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 10:36:16 AM EST
    [ Parent ]

    Re: Empty comments (none / 0)

    Talking about giving up nukes are some other countries, like Iran, work to aquire them isn't going to win the hearts and minds of a lot of Americans.

    Rejecting the notion of a global war on terrorism isn't a winner either.  I don't like the bumper sticker title either, but it has stuck, and we do have a terrorists problem on our hands on at least 3 continents.

    Lastly, Americans have followed Iraq pretty closely.  Most understand the challenges of getting out and the consequences of leaving to quickly.   It will take at least 2 years to withdraw our main combat forced in a safe manner.   We will still need to protect our embassy and it won't be the usual Marine operation.  

    If we pull out too quickly with can see anything from genocide to Iran rushing in to fill the void that we leave.  Edwards doesn't address these issues at all (nor does Richardson).


    by dpANDREWS on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 10:43:58 AM EST
    [ Parent ]

    Re: Empty comments (2.00 / 1)

    Rejecting the notion of a global war on terrorism isn't a winner either.  I don't like the bumper sticker title either, but it has stuck, and we do have a terrorists problem on our hands on at least 3 continents.

    Im afraid you've fallen right into the trap of the GWOT rhetoric.  Of course we have a problem, and Edwards layed out a comprehensive plan to deal with terrorism in May.  But we need to do it without rhetoric of fear and jingoism and lies to the American people.

    Honesty needs to return to the WH.  I think it would make good strides with Clinton at the helm, but she needs to ask more, strive for more.  She owes it to the party and the people of this country.  She seems content, that is my beef with Clinton.


    Hoosiers for Hill -- Barack Obama
    by BWasikIUgrad on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 10:55:19 AM EST
    [ Parent ]

    I am looking at the politics (none / 0)

    You can be right and lose.  I agree with:

    "But we need to do it without rhetoric of fear and jingoism and lies to the American people."

    But I also watched John Kerry try to EXPLAIN to Americans his vision of how to handle the war, a vision I thought was better than Bush's, and he got beat.  He got beat because he could communicate clearly and concisely within frames that already existed and he couldn't change.

    Now if you can change how the media, and America frames the debate, hey thats great.  You win.  Do you think you can do that?


    by dpANDREWS on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 11:10:13 AM EST
    [ Parent ]

    Kerry could not ... Kerry could not communicate (none / 0)

    that not was sort of an important word to leave out


    by dpANDREWS on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 11:11:13 AM EST
    [ Parent ]

    Re: Ezra Klein (2.00 / 1)

    At this point, I think it's disingenuous of Ezra Klein to say he doesn't know who he'll vote for. Can Ezra Klein really be that uninformed? I don't think he should be doing pundit posturing on the talk show circuit if he doesn't know where candidates stand on the issues by now. Not that being uninformed about candidates ever kept anyone off of Tucker Carlson's show, or Chris Matthews' show, come to think of it.

    I've already decided: Edwards gets my vote in the primary. Whoever wins the Democratic Party nomination will get my vote in the general. Democrats will choose their nominee, and when they do, I hope all Democrats will unite behind their nominee whoever he or she may be. I'm sick of reading the "never voting for Clinton' missives from so-called 'progressives' who have forgotten the 'inconvenient truth' of Al Gore's loss in 2000 thanks partly to Ralph Nader. Don't let it happen again, Democrats. It's Democrats v. Republicans at that point, and we need to win the White House too.

    Just sayin'


    "I never give them hell. I just tell the truth and they think it's hell." Harry S Truman
    by Tennessean on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 12:10:59 PM EST

    Re: Ezra Klein (none / 0)

    I don't think Ezra is saying he doesn't know where the candidates stand on the issues.  He's one of the wonkiest pundits we have.


    "Another problem we have...is that in election years we behave somewhat as primitive peoples do at the time of the full moon." --Harry Truman
    by Steve M on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 04:18:55 PM EST
    [ Parent ]

    Re: John Edwards / GWT (none / 0)

    You say:


    Edwards has rejected the Global War On Terror frame, Obama has accepted it.

    The last debate showed clearly how wrong that statement is.  John gets a lot of praise for coming out and saying GWOT is a bumper sticker - of course it is, it is a slogan, just like the War on Drugs and the War on Poverty.  I'm not saying it is a bad thing to highlight the sloganeering aspect of the phrase, but then you need to go much deeper.  There is a struggle against terror as a political tactic which cuts across many nations of the World.  We can't deny that.  The whole point, at least to me, is to recognize not so much the bumper sticker but the point of the bumper sticker - which is to hold us in constant fear.  What we need to be careful is not so much the use of the phrase as it is continuing the unfounded fear.  A clear example of this was Russert's question about pledging to deny Iran a nuclear bomb.  It wasn't Edwards who turned this question around and threw it back at Russert, it was Obama.  He rightfully refused to play this game and immediately talked about fear.

    That is fully understanding that what is important about the GWOT frame is not the frame itself but the picture it holds.  I'm not going to comment about Edwards, but it is completely false to claim that Obama is somehow lacking in this area.  From his stance to talk to any World leader without pre-conditions, to his recognition that what we need in Pakistan is not just an Ally but a Democratic Ally, to his admonition to Russert to lower the fear rhetoric on Iran, he fully accepts and understands that beyond the bumper sticker lies Roosevelt's words - "the only thing we have to fear is fear itself".


    by Piuma on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 01:10:43 PM EST


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